Westfield - Family History & Genealogy Message Board

Re: Mary Elizabeth Westfield

chawner_1 — 2012-03-04 10:27:34Z

Hi Kim,
My maiden name Mary Elizabeth Westfield, now Chawner.
Some of the people you mention could very likely be connected with the Thomas Babester born Dublin (revised 1892) There was a Thomas Babester soldier rank Private on the 1911 census Military returns born Dublin age 19, single and in the 101 Reg. Dublin Fus. You can pick up his marriage and children on Ancestry. It could be possible in my tree for a Pauline A Davis born Ireland to be part of this family but other children born Essex, so not really sure. For more info my email is chawner@post.com

Re: Mary Elizabeth Westfield

beach8771 — 2012-03-03 03:47:30Z

My granmother madien name was Babester... Her name was Pauline Annie... Do you know if there is any relation to the Thomas Babester that You have reference to in this message... It was thought that she was from Quebec Canada.. but ended up in Ireland where she married a Davis and had three children one whom was my mother... I would appreciate any help trying to find some back ground on her...

Sincerely
Kim

George Westfield married to Unknown McCann

cpcrossey — 2011-06-02 15:58:20Z

Hi folks, trying to get info on a twig on my tree -

My gg grandfather, Michael Diamond, married a Mary McCann, somewhere around 1860. This was in/around Ahoghill, Antrim, Ireland.
Mary had an unnamed sister who married a George Westfield and this couple then ended up in Canada, or possibly USA. Apologies, I know this is all very vague.

Anyway, I can place Mrs Westfield on the outskirts of Kingston, Ontario, in 1923 as she appears in a photo sent to my family by another batch of the Diamond clan. In this photo she is an elderly woman.

So, apologies, for this vague query, but if anyone can provide info,I'd appreciate it.

Ciaran Crossey
cpcrossey at gmail.com

Mary and Sue

cambridgecerocman — 2010-02-15 09:09:39Z

I have sent you an email.

Re: Mary Elizabeth Westfield

chawner_1 — 2009-12-05 20:49:13Z

Great stuff David, Thanks for your trouble and patience. I am really hoping there is more on the film - parents of marriage parties. If so it would be a major step.
Thanks,
Mary Chawner

Re: Mary Elizabeth Westfield

cambridgecerocman — 2009-12-05 17:20:52Z

Thank you Mary. I went round to the Mormon Church this morning, spoke to Yyvon and ordered the film. It will take around 3 weeks to come.

Re: Mary Elizabeth Westfield

chawner_1 — 2009-12-05 01:17:39Z

David, here are the 2 messages from Yvonne
*
*

Hello David.
I got straight on the trail of John Westfield and Elizabeth Warner.
The record from the IGI was taken from Parish Records.The only information there is whats on the record.
I found it in the site I have access too.
Happy to order the parish records if you wish.
Please let me know.
Regards Yvonne
another message fro David Smith ref Elizabeth and John

I have tracked down the exact film number you need to order to view the record of the aboves marriage.
It is number 1473719 .
It is birth deaths and marriages the marriages are for the Marriages, 1799-1818.
I will continue to look for you.
But may have to just order this film for you.
Regards Yvonne Menzies

Messages intended for David From Yvonne sent on by Mary C

Re: Mary Elizabeth Westfield

chawner_1 — 2009-11-24 14:51:40Z

Thanks David,
I looked in Norfolk Records Office several years ago and found the number of Warners and Waites overwhelming. It is really great that you have decided to purchase the marriage certificate of George Robert Warner. I have tried other ways again with no success. There is a George Robert Warner in the 1871 census and he is lodging with Henry Huson, occupation tailor and wife Charlotte at 19 Napoleon Place Great Yarmouth. This Warner's occupation is Attorney's Clerk. He could be the correct one, but there is no family with him. I looked up Henry Huson in your link to Norfolk Records and found him in Title Deeds Great Yarmouth Title for Napoleon Place. Date 1869-1897. Description Settlement by Henry Huson and wife charlotte of nos. 16-20 Napoleon Place (formerly Archer Place), purchased in 1867 by Charlotte (then Charlotte Mace widow) from John Bowgin, 1869; and release by Charlotte Griffiths following conveyance to trustees, 1897. In the BMD Index is Henry Huson married Charlotte Mace in 1867 at Yarmouth Norfolk 4b page 29, 3rd quarter. Ancestry threw up a hint for the 1851 census where there is a George R Warner age 2 living a West Wymer Street Heigham Norwich and his father George Warner age 27 is a brass founders clerk ( I think this is the occupation, the writing is very poor) and his mother's name is Harriet age 28. The other one in the Records office is a William Warner who purchases a copper smith business from his cousin J.N.Waite senior. Another hint came up at St. George Tombland Norwich for 1861 census where his name is Robert and not George but mother's name Harriet. There are so many Warners I have no way of knowing the correct ones. I am pretty certain however of the names of a couple of children of Alice Rosalie and George Robert Warner. One of them Esther Florence Warner is buried in the Westfield family plots at Abney Park Cemetery 27th July 1882 aged 18 months old Section D04 Index 3S01 Burial 071678. She is in London Eng Births & Baptisms with the mother Alice Rosalie Warner and Father George Robert Warner and in the Births BMD for 1881 Registered 2nd qtr. Another child is Walter Robert Warner names of parents fully described again in the London Eng Births & Baptisms. Unfortunately my subscription not high enough to view the dates so I do not know when Walter Robert Warner was born. Someone else's tree on ancestry has him born 10 May 1893 but this is not possible as far as I am concerned unless it was by another mother because I believe Alice Rosalie died in 1887. This other person has got a bit mixed because they have Walter Robert Warner in the 1891 census and they also have him born in 1893 (alive before he was born) The confusion many lay in the fact that perhaps in the Warner family they behaved like the Westfields and got baptized when they were several years old or even when they were adults. The census record they attached to him also does not make sense. The Westfield family were great travellers probably because of the military and clergy associations. Certain parts of the family had astounding wealth particulary the ones who had multiple estates in Gloucestershire, Wiltshire, Somerset and Hampstead/ Highgate/Hornsey/Shoreditch London. I think some of your Warner family share a similar background. Of course many of them were just the poor relations from younger sons and daughters like me. I am keeping my fingers crossed that you get a good result on the certificate.
Mary Chawner.

Re: Mary Elizabeth Westfield

cambridgecerocman — 2009-11-22 18:49:15Z

The certificate below has now been ordered. Note that Alice has changed her first names around as I suspect Robert George has as well. Could have been a fashion at the time.

Alice Rosalie Westfield E/W Marriage 1 27 Nov 2009 Westfield/Warner
Year Qtr District Vol Page Reg Ent No DOR
1876 Jun Marylebone 1a 901

Decided to do this first as it is the one in million chance that could not happen unless they are related as cousins. The parents names should prove the point.

Re: Mary Elizabeth Westfield

cambridgecerocman — 2009-11-22 17:19:02Z

Following on from Mary's comments about middle names. These are often echos from the past when they usually represent and female maiden name of a mother or grandmother. I did a quick google and found the following resource on ancestry at:

//freepages.genealogy.rootsweb.ancestry.com/~hughwallis/

If you look at norfolk and type in some names such as Spratt, Newman, Gardiner, Sutton, Waite and Warner you will get some interesting results. Unfortuately many of his results are post 1800 but there are some clues as to what happened in the past particularly with Newman, Waite and Gardiner.

For the moment I will not look at this but some of Mary's theories are very intriguing.

Re: Mary Elizabeth Westfield

cambridgecerocman — 2009-11-22 09:36:13Z

PS The link does not work try
1 http://nrocat.norfolk.gov.uk/Dserve/public/searches/nroquick...

2 Search for Waite
3 Look at Waite of Norwich and Bramerton Executorship M328

David

Re: Mary Elizabeth Westfield

cambridgecerocman — 2009-11-22 09:31:55Z

Good morning Mary,

I did see your post which adds more backing to the link between the Westfields and the Warners. Unfortunately I do not know the names of the individuals in the photo. I was hoping you or Sue would do but you do not.

There does seem to be some intriguing ideas about where the Westfields and Warners came from. I assume that you have been looking at the Waites and Earls on my tree. You and Sue may be interested in the Waite of Norwich and Bramerton Executorship paper lodged at the Norwich Archive. A summary can be found here:

http://nrocat.norfolk.gov.uk/Dserve/dserve.exe?dsqServer=128...')

I was actually going to look at them this weekend but I got the William Waite Warner hit this week and I am going to concentrate on that. There are 33 bundles of documents refering to business interests and many family members some of which ended up in America.

For the moment I am going to put my efforts in consolidating on everything downwind of John Warner and Elizabeth Waite. I am paranoid that my research is double AA quality. Also by doing so it is likely that more evidence will come along.

Apart from emailing artifacts like photos, certificates etc between us I will post my findings here. If you and Sue had not done so here I would never have seen the significance of the the breakthrough finding William Waite Warner earlier this week. It is possible that someone else might bring something to the table as well as a result of this thread.

I find it facinating that this thread was started in 2004. Lets make it a really long one.

David

Re: Mary Elizabeth Westfield

chawner_1 — 2009-11-22 02:11:51Z

Thanks David,
I have just seen your reply to my post. Yes I think there are possibilities here. Did you know that in the past there was a family called Bowyer and he used the alias Turner. I think off the top of my head they were around at the time of Lord Rich an Englishman but he had the title the Earl of Holland. The Chaplain to both the earl of Holland and his son was Rev Thomas Westfield who later became the Bishop of Bristol. Lord Rich was Thomas Westfield's patron. There are some very strange goings on with the Earls family relationships. By the way the Earl ended up losing his head by the Parliamentarians I think. I need to have another look at all of this and I will let you know how the Bowyer and Turner comes in to this.
Mary Chawner

Re: Mary Elizabeth Westfield

cambridgecerocman — 2009-11-21 17:10:57Z

Correction 'William Waite Warner who died in 1871' should read 'William Warner who died in 1871'. He was never known with Waite as a middle name.

Re: Mary Elizabeth Westfield

cambridgecerocman — 2009-11-21 15:33:03Z

Mary and Sue,

Thank you Mary for the last post.

Both you and Sue have provided enough information for me to say that the families are definitely linked. Several more threads have come from your last post.

1 Elizabeth Westfield ended up living with Margret Bruff. On my tree Margret Waites Warner b 1784 and Elizabeth Waite Warner b 1785 are likely to be the same people.
2 Rosalie Westfield married George Robert Warner. I have a Robert George Warner born probably just before 1850 and would have been a candidate for the marriage. I only know of him at the moment because he receives £100 in the 1871 will of his grandfather William Warner (brother of Margret and Elizabeth who is probably Elizabeth Westfield). The cousin William W Warner appearing the 1871 census also received £500 as the son (the Warners were flush with cash in the early 1870's). In the will George Robert is down as Robert George. I would not be surprised in a change around of Christian names. William Charles Warner b 1853 on my tree, who I am still looking for in the 1871 census, and is Robert George Warner’s cousin is down as William Charles Warner in the 1881 census but on his marriage certificate in 1883 is Charles William Warner.
3 George Robert Warner came from Norwich in the 1881 census.

With all the other prima facie evidence I am in no doubt that the common link to both families is Elizabeth Waite Warner b 1785. I am sure you will have some concerns about me saying this without seeing the actual evidence at first hand. Do not worry I fully intend to go through all of it with a fine tooth comb, put it on my website and allow you to scrutinise it. However for it not to be true then it would have required our ancestors to have conspired together for over a century for the sole purpose of fooling descendants who wanted to look into their history and then cut those individuals out of the conspiracy!

One killer bullet to prove the link would be obtaining he marriage certificate of Rosalie Westfield. If the parents of Rosalie and George match the respective parents on either tree then it would be a one in a million chance if the families were not linked in any other way. Has anyone got the marriage certificate? I don’t suppose so or you would have mentioned it. If not I will order it. Do you both think this is a good test?

Another thing about the Rosalie marriage. William Charles Warner and Robert George Warner were cousins. I cannot find William Charles Warner or his mother in the 1871 census and I am hoping that will come soon and explain why the family broke up in Norwich and moved to London. William and Robert were roughly the same age. I have a photograph, which could be a wedding photograph of some kind. It could be the Rosalie wedding or the wedding of William Charles Warner to my great grandmother. It looks like one man is the groom and the other the best man. I will send it to you and maybe you may recognise one or both from other photos you may have.

Mary – I understand what you say about allowing Elizabeth and Margret to be paupers. He was in London and may not have known. There were other relatives doing very well in Norwich notably their likely brother William Waite Warner who died in 1871 with an estate in the £3000 category employing 13 men and one boy. Perhaps they could have helped. We don’t know the circumstances in which they lived and through genealogy can only give us a glimpse of what their lives were like.

Moving on to Mary’s last comments about the Lord Mayor of London and Bishop Thomas Westfield. To prove a link would be fantastic. You should note that my tree goes back to the marriage of George Waite and Elizabeth Turner in 1743 who are likely to be zillions of greats grandparents before you.

I shall visit the Mormon Church on Wednesday and will be starting from the basics of looking at the parish records for the marriage of Elizabeth Westfield and George Westfield and the birth of George Westfield 1820. I will then work methodically checking the information you have provided and work chronologically through the census.

I would appreciate comments before hand and any first hand scans of documents before I start to give me clues. I will update my website to share with you as I go along.

David

Re: Mary Elizabeth Westfield

marychawner — 2009-11-20 12:37:28Z

Hi David,

NOTES ON THE WARNER CONNECTION

Re John Westfield born circa 1773 – 1776 (There are inconsistencies with age but this is not unusual due to 2 factors (a) Rounding down in 1841 census (b) Information given by informant on death certificate is not always accurate.

In 1841 Census his address is given as Black Swan Yard in the Civil parish of St Michael At Thorn in the City of Norwich, hundred of Norwich County Norfolk – Sub Registration district Conisford. His Age is given as 60 on 1841 census but in the 1841 census they had rounding down so he could have been between 60 and 65. There is also an Elizabeth Westfield living at this address – relationship not given and her age is 45 again rounded so she could be between 45 and 50.

1851 Census at Norwich St. Augustine. I believe this is his widow or daughter Elizabeth Westfield who was the informant on his death certificate, if she is the widow then her previous name could well have been Warner. Her age is given as 65 making her born about 1786 and she is living with her sister Margaret Bruff. They are both described as Paupers and they are both widows. Their address is Middle Street, Crown and Anchor Yard Norwich.

BMD Index there is an Elizabeth Westfield died March quarter 1857.

Death Certificate of John Westfield died 5th Sep 1849 died at St. Michael at Thorn Sub-district of Conisford in the city & County of Norfolk. Registration District Norwich. Age on Certificate 76 years puts his birthdate at 1773. His Occupation given as Window-blind Maker. Informant Elizabeth Westfield present at the death. Black Swan Yard Ber Street St. Michael at Thorn.

Where born on 1841 census - John Westfield was NOT born in the county of Norfolk but Elizabeth Westfield was born in Norfolk.

John’s son George John was born in Norwich in 1820 and this son George John was married in 1843 at Great Yarmouth to Anne Elizabeth Smith, Full age, Spinster, occupation Milliner. George John Westfield, full age, Bachelor occup Tutor – residence at the time of marriage for both bride & groom was Row no 49 Yarmouth. Her father was James Smith occupation Draper. His father was John Westfield occupation Cabinet Maker. We think it highly likely John cabinet maker is the one born 1773-1776.

Marriage Certificate of Frank Henry Westfield (born 1851) Bankers clerk and Isabel Hills marriage on 1st April 1872 address looks like 8 Cooper Row same for Isobell Hills. On this certificate it has his father as George John Warner Westfield occupation Schoolmaster. Marriage was at the Parish Church All Hallows Hackney in the County of London.

This Frank Henry born 1851 who married Isabel Hills in 1872 is a known brother of George John Warner Westfield born in 1844 at Norwich Norfolk. It is only by this marriage certificate that I found that the father of George John Warner Westfield born in 1844 was in fact also called George John Warner Westfield of 1820. Previously I only referred to him as George John Westfield circa 1820.

No where else does George John Westfield born 1820 seem to use the Warner middle name. In fact he hasn’t used it himself as far as I can see but it is his son Frank who has used it on his marriage certificate for his father’s name.

I have the original marriage certificate of George John Warner Westfield born in 1844 to Mary Sarah Miller marriage in 1864 handed down in our family and on this it just shows George John Warner Westfield’s father as George John Westfield Occupation Schoolmaster.

Another son of the Schoolmaster is William James Westfield and it is interesting that in the 1861 census at 5 King Street Shoreditch St. Leonard and his father George J Westfield occupation Schoolmaster and mother Anne E. William James in this 1861 census is written as William J. W. Son 15 Clerk in eastern counties Railways. I am thinking that perhaps his full name is William James Warner Westfield also. I have a lot of detail on William James Westfield and his 2 marriages and his children. On the same census his father’s cousin is listed as John W Warner age 31 an assistant in the school.

Alice Rosalie Westfield daughter of George John Westfield born 1820 is aged 11 in the same 1861 census goes on to marry George Robert Warner in 1876 at Marylebone London 2nd quarter.

. Under the Will of George John who died 9th Dec 1904 is noted the children of the testator and includes Alice Rosalie, wife of George Robert Warner. He is also listed as an Executor on the will.

Address of George Robert Warner in November 1884 is 2 Tilia Road Hackney and his occupation is Solicitor’s Clerk. He is named as an Executor on the will of George John Westfield born 1820 who wrote his will Nov 1884 and who died in 1904. However George Robert Warner died before his father in law so he was dead before 1904.

I think he is the George Robert Warner aged 31 who is in the 1881 census in the Small Pox Hospital at Deptford London and who was born in Norwich Norfolk. He is married and his occupation is listed as Horse Keeper. If he was suffering from Small Pox he must have got over it because he is alive in 1884, 3 years later. That is if he is the correct George Robert Warner as it a bit strange that he is listed as a horse keeper when he was a solicitors attorney in 1871 and a solicitors clerk in 1884.
One of the Cousins who appears in the census returns with George John Warner Westfield born 1820 is John W Warner born about 1832. He is in the 1861 Census age 31 an assistant at the school of George John Warner Westfield.

Possibly this could be John W Warner commercial Clerk in the 1881 census with a wife called Sarah - ?? could be the Sarah Low sharing same page in BMD Index with John Waite Warner 1873. John Waite Warner died in 1902 at Norwich Norfolk.

Another of the Cousins who appears in the census returns with George John Warner Westfield born 1820 is a William Warner born circa 1819 or 1820 born at Norwich Norfolk and listed as a cousin and his occupation is Clerk.

David I have a lot of ideas floating about in the depths of my mind and a couple of Wild card things that I will probably look into one day is the Lord Mayor of London who was a Warner way back in a similar time frame to the offspring of Bishop Thomas Westfield 1573 -1644 (offspring between 2 wives born roughly between 1597 and 1625). Way back in about 1700 a Job Warner married a Westfield I think may have been Elizabeth. On the Dover/Kent Westfield Tree there are quite possibly links with London and Lincolnshire Westfields as well as Buckinghamshire Monks Risborough.

I thought the Waite part might go back to a Linconshire tree of a Henry Westfield but I am not certain about this. I need to do some more study and take care more to write down all my findings.

My father John Westfield used to belong to the Canberra Genealogy Club and he did a great deal of research which has aided me considerably in building up about 10 Westfield Trees on Ancestry.co.uk

If you ever manage to crack the link I would really love to have it. It is a bit hard for me in Australia as I cannot visit the parishes in U.K.

It is possible that the John Westfield Cabinet maker was twice married and that the informant is his second wife if not his daughter.

The reason for this view is that I cannot imagine why my Great Great Grandfather who was enjoying a little success in his life in 1849 and 1857 the dates of death of John and Elizabeth did not assist them more. (Elizabeth listed as Pauper 1851 census)
My father was not convinced this John was the correct John Westfield to be the father because of this reason, but I think the evidence points to it. George John Westfield circa 1820 was probably still living in Norfolk in 1844 because his eldest son was born there at St. Faith’s Lane in 1844 but they have obviously come to London between 1844 and 1846. William James Westfield the 2nd son was born at Islington, or Balls Pond or Kingsland (all exactly the same place) in 1846.

By the way I am the grand-daughter of George John Miller Westfield born 1866. He had my father in 1921 his last and only child from his second marriage. I was only 2 years old when he died in 1950 in Kent. I come from his second marriage to Emma Elizabeth Taylor and Sue comes from his first wife Martha Kelly.

Good Luck with this,
Regards Mary Chawner.

Re: Mary Elizabeth Westfield

cambridgecerocman — 2009-11-19 20:26:50Z

Mary,

There is so much to take in here after 12 years. I am going to print off everything and digest. I am in no doubt that the link between my Warners and the Westfields is already proved due to the amount of circumstantial evidence between the lines (people turning up on different census of right age and name, the name Waite and Warner being used on both sides of the family, the marriage in 1813 which fits). I would like you to point me to yet another bit of circumstantial evidence as well please. I can see the marriage of Alice Rosalie Westfield in BMD. You may have the information by census. Can you tell me to the name of the Warner she married and where you spotted it please? You may even have the marriage certificate. If it is William Charles Warner that would be icing on the cake for me. I have been looking for him for 12 years also.

Sue and Mary,

Most of my sources are referenced on my website. I would be happy to provide originals of certificates and any other material you request. I am hoping that if you have any of the same that I need then you could provide to me as well.

After digesting the information and visiting the local Mormon church to do research I shall update my website linking both families.

David

Re: Mary Elizabeth Westfield

cambridgecerocman — 2009-11-18 18:51:01Z

ps I have only 3 sibblings at the Elizabeth Waite Warner level. Its possible she died and, as is the custom, they named another daughter after her which would bring the marriage date into a more sensible range.

I don't mind looking at this but I am wondering if someone has done some work already.

Re: Mary Elizabeth Westfield

cambridgecerocman — 2009-11-18 18:48:04Z

Hello Mary,

I will have to be quick as I am off out soon.

First I am in no doubt they are linked. 2 of mine, William Waite Warner and the younger brother match the census records. I have been looking for William Waite Warner for over 12 years and 2 days ago I found him.

The problem is how the 'cousin' thing works. The only way is if John Westfield's mother was a Warner. The name of the junior John Westfield with a Warner in it is a give away.

The best candidate in my tree (see website) is Elizabeth Waite Warner b.1785. 1813 is a little late for her to be getting married but who knows the circumstances.

Hope you can understand what I mean. Maybe Sue will be able to shed some light as well.

Off out.

Dave

Re: Mary Elizabeth Westfield

marychawner — 2009-11-18 15:59:57Z

Hi David, My email chawner@post.com I have tried very hard to tie in the Warners and yes I found the 2 Waite Warners several years ago and thought they were highly likely candidates. I have used several approaches, one of these has been to try and tie in the Warner wife who I think I found in the 1851 census. Another approach was to follow the Warner married to Alice Rosalie Westfield - the College proprietor's daughter. I have even tried to follow the Smith family (Spouse of Coll Prop)from Norfolk and James Smith Draper with limited success. The IGI's Ref I037821 the marriage of John Westfield to Elizabeth Warner at Queenborough in Kent which is on the Isle of Sheppey. A ferry service in the old days from Sheppey up to Great Yarmouth, also the well to do people on Sheppey would think nothing of frequent visits to London to catch all the latest shows. Please email me, I will look up my Warner/Westfield research folder. Mary Chawner.

Re: Mary Elizabeth Westfield

cambridgecerocman — 2009-11-18 09:12:00Z

Please see message sent to Sue via email. I just found I can post now.

*******************************************************

Hello Sue,

My name is David Smith and I saw your thread about the Westfields on boards ancestry but could was not able to respond there despite joining.

I think we are very distantly related via the Warners and am interested from Mary's comment about you linking George Westfield to them from Queenborough in Kent in Kent. I know for a fact they are linked but not certain of the detail and I am hoping you can fill this in. I shall tell you what I know:

1 Please look at my website at http://freepages.genealogy.rootsweb.ancestry.com/~davesmiths...

and follow the link back from Emma Alice Warner (my nan) to see the family tree going back to William Warner b 1788. If you then click on William Warner b 1788 (twice) you will see his father, mother and sibblings Margret and Elizabeth.

2 I have enclosed the 1871 census with George Westfield born around 1815 (he is down as 65) . You will notice that residing is William W Warner described as cousin. After 12 years of searching I have just found him in Ancestry (there had been a transcription error). You will see that William Waite Warner is the son of William Warner b 1788 from my website. To me that means it is likely that the link to George Westfield is via either Margret or Elizabeth or an unknown female sibbling.

It is clear to me that there is a Norwich, Norfolk connection as George Westfield, his wife Anne and William W Warner all were born there in the 1871 census. Not certain where the Queenborough bit comes in.

Other information: William Waite Warner's younger brother John Waite Warner is residing with George Westfield in the 1861 census. I suspect that George Westfield helped his wider family out when times were hard. William Waite Warner was sitting comfortably in Norwich with wife Emma b 1824, son William Charles Warner b 1853, daughers Charllote b 1851 and Emma b 1857. There seems to have been some sort of catasrophe. Charllote and William Charles disappear in 1871 and so has the mother (who may be dead). I might have a hit on Emma lodging nearby. William Charles (my g grandfather) turns up in the 1881 census aged 29 in Greenwich as a potman (collects glasses in pubs).

Hope you understand all this. I am after primarily the link between Warner and Westfield and any other info on how William Waite Warner ended up with John Westfield.

I live in Cambridge. Think you are in the UK. Happy chat on the telephone or email. Would like to share with others but if I can't then happy for you to post for me.

Thank you.

David

Re: Neil Westfield and father Donald.

marychawner — 2009-10-22 04:35:37Z

Hi Neil, Good to hear from you. Yes I am certain we are related. I do know who your grandparents were. Please email me chawner@post.com and I can tell you a great deal more about this family.
Regards Mary Elizabeth Chawner (nee Westfield) P.S. I am the grand-daughter of George John Miller Westfield and I am 13 years younger than Don your father. It makes me feel a bit old when I am GJM's grand-daugher and he is your great grandfather. Hope to get an email from you soon. Mary.

Re: Correction to previous post on Mary Elizabeth Westfield

limey705 — 2009-10-21 20:22:32Z

You may be related to me. I have traced back from me, Neil Westfield, my Dad, Don Westfield, g.father Stephen H westfield, g.g.father a George John Miller Westfield, born 20th oct 1866 in millingar Ireland. Do you have more info???? thanks
Neil

Re: Mary Elizabeth Westfield

sueoctaes — 2009-10-20 21:46:02Z

Hi Tracy

Re the death of Mary Sarah on board ship I heard that she had a fall and was injured in some way I found a record of her death on the Maritime Death Registry which said she died of some sort of blood poisoning, but that doesn't seem right as the memorial card said she was buried on the night of her accident which wouldn't have left any time for blood poisoning to occur, guess we will never know the full story.

I was told a story of the childrens return to England by a ggreat uncle of mine, he said that when they reached Ceylon ttheir father sent them back to England and on the way they wwere shipwrecked of the Cape of Good Hope (S Africa) but rescued and kitted out with clothes before they were sent on to England, the boys, George John Miller (my great grandfather) and Frank were sent to their grandfather's (he's the old man in the picture I sent you)school in Leyton, London and the girls including Minnie were sent to a military orphanage. I haven't found any details of the orphanage but on a census I found Minnie living with an aunt and uncle and the boys at the college.

As you may know George John Warner Westfield married again a much younger woman, Milly Wood, and several more children. I have never been able to find a picture of him though.

I have attached another picture of George John Westfield in his masonic regalia, he was a grand master at his local lodge in Leyton.

Let me know if there is anything else you would like to know, send a email to me at my email address suecoates@dial3.co.uk.

Sue

Re: Mary Elizabeth Westfield

tracy_copping — 2009-10-20 14:00:53Z

hi mary Edith bailey was married to Thomas Babester dob abt 1898 dublin, and had 8 children,Eva bailey was indeed married to Fred Bannister and had no children .i was in contact with Eva and she died only a couple of years ago.hope this helps email me if you need any more information.

Re: Mary Elizabeth Westfield

tracy_copping — 2009-10-20 13:52:58Z

thankyou for sending me those wonderful pictures my mum who is eighty was thrilled because she has very little information on her family,she lived with minnie and remembers her well,she is convinced there was a a mystery around mary westfields death,told by minnie but she was so young at the time she cant remember much do you have any more information on this? also the passage back to england?and any other information you can share I also have information on the bailey family if you would like any .yours thankfully Tracy Copping

Re: Mary Elizabeth Westfield

sueoctaes — 2009-10-19 21:36:52Z

Hi Tracey

There does appear to be some link I am descended from Minnie's older brother George John Westfield he was my great grandfather. I know quite a bit about the Westfield family, especially my branch. If there is anything specific you want to know my e mail is suecoates@dial3.co.uk, just let me know. Did you know that Minnie's father, also George John Westfield was in the Royal Army Medical Corps as was my great grandfather?

I have attached some pictures to this message, hope you can see them ok, they are Mary Sarah and her death announcment card, also her father in law George John Westfield and her oldest son George John Miller Westfield (my great grandfather)

Regards
Sue Coates (nee Westfield)

Re: Mary Elizabeth Westfield

marychawner — 2009-10-17 07:52:41Z

Hi Tracy, Minnie Wilhelmina 1870-1962 full siblings were Mary Elizabeth Westfield b.23Jul1865 Mullingar Westmeath Ireland. George John Miller Westfield b.20Oct1866 Mullingar, Frank Henry 1872 Lancashire, Margaret Florence Westfield born 1874 Lancashire. Minnie's half siblings (by her father's second wife) were Thomas Hipple Westfield 1885-1954, Frederick Charles Westfield b. 1887, Ellen Florence Westfield 1893-1981,Mildred Westfield b.1896, Edward James Westfield b.1897, Winifred Bertha Westfield b. 1899, Kathleen Sarah Westfield b.1901, Robert Wood Westfield b.1902. There could have been one or two full siblings born between 1874 and 1878. Re Edith Bailey b 1898 Hackney, do you have the full name and d.o.b. of her husband ? and of Eva's husband (I think Eva b.1912 married Fred Bannister can you confirm if this is correct) Thanks Mary Elizabeth Westfield born 1948 (married name Chawner)

Re: Mary Elizabeth Westfield

tracy_copping — 2009-10-16 17:45:58Z

hi my name is tracy think were related somewear done the line iam the great grandaughter of silas and minnie bailey nee westfield i have struggled to find information on the westfield family and have been told by my mother that there were many more siblings of minnie but she did not even no how many herself my mum lived with her gran during the war years and remembers her gran was convinced her mothers death on board ship was no accident but i have no facts on this story and she was very young at the time.minnie had five daughters and one son florance.Edith[ my nan]roseina,Elsie,Eva,and William Bailey sadly silas was killed during ww1 so it sounds like poor minnie had a tough life during the war years she moved from london to nuneaton and lived to a ripe old age i have recently been to ypes and visited silas baileys war grave which was very fitting because i have a son myself who is serving in the british army.Hope any of this infomation is helpful to you ,and perhaps she have some you can share with me .

I can help you find information on the Westfields from easley, princeton and greenville sc

kimrgriffin — 2009-01-05 17:48:00Z

kimrgriffin@live.com
my maiden name is Westfield and I am located in MD

Re: Mary Elizabeth Westfield

marychawner — 2008-05-05 17:40:49Z

Hi Sue,
spotted your reply thanks, yes you did send me a couple of photos but I already had these particular ones. My grandfather was the son of George John Warner Westfield and the brother of Mary Elizabeth that you were inquiring about. My grandfather's name was George John Miller Westfield born in October 1866 - we think his birthday was the same day as my fathers John Westfield born 19th October 1921. I was about 2 years old when my grandfather died. I am the result of my grandfather's second marriage to Emma Elizabeth Taylor with whom he only had one child and that was my father. If I remember correctly I think you descend from my grandfather's son by his first wife Martha Kelly and he was William George Westfield (Bill) my dad's half brother. I am doing this all from memory at 3.30am in the morning (couldn't sleep) I will suffer for it tomorrow. Have you managed to get the Warner connection yet from Queenborough in Kent - I think it was you who told me about it. Regards Mary Chawner Australia

Re: Mary Elizabeth Westfield

SueCoates42 — 2008-05-05 10:50:54Z

Hi Mary

Yes I do remember being in contact with you before as Mary Chawner.
Since posting that message I have done a lot more research and also found that the Mary Elizabeth Westfield I was trying to trace was the Mary who married Harry Wakefield. I have a copy of their marriage certificate - not sure whether I have sent it to you or not.
Anyway they were married in Aldershot, which is where I was born. Her father was at her wedding.
The mystery I was trying to solve was where did the girls - Mary Elizabeth and Minnie - go after their mother died on board the ship. It seems that Minnie went to live with her aunt and uncle and the boys went to their grandfather's college, did Mary stay with her father, in Ceylon, as she was the oldest girl?
Not sure if I have told you the family story about the childrens traumatic journey back to England after their mother died or not.
Anyway do feel free to contact me again - suecoates@dial3.co.uk -I have lots of photos and certificates but of course I may already have sent them to you. I have have sent things to so many people and have lotst track I should really keep a record.
I may have already asked you this before but the only Westfield man I do not have a photo of is George John Warner Westfield, who I believe was your great grandfather and my great great grandfather, do you have such a photo.
Also remind me again of who your grandfather was. As I think I may have said before I am linked to George John Westfield (the college owner) through his oldest son George John Warner Westfield.
Anyway look forward to hearing from you again soon.

Regards
Sue Coates (nee Westfield)

Correction to previous post on Mary Elizabeth Westfield

marychawner — 2008-05-05 05:43:17Z

Sorry I meant to say in my last post that two of the brothers of Mary Elizabeth Westfield born Mullingar Ireland in 1864 can be seen in the 1881 census listed as GRANDSONS (not nephews as I put) of George John Westfield born 1820 and his wife Anne Elizabeth. These 2 brothers are George John Miller Westfield born Mullingar 1866 and Frank Henry Westfield born Preston Lancashire in 1872. Minnie their sister was sent to live with her uncle Frank in West Smithfield London and a couple of the other kids may have ended up in a military orphanage, one or two of them eventually turned up with living with their father's second wife Milly Wood. Mary Chawner.

Re: Mary Elizabeth Westfield

marychawner — 2008-05-04 15:57:50Z

Hi Sue, it is Mary Elizabeth Westfield here born 1948, and I live in Australia - you already know me- married name Chawner. I also have been looking for my grandfathers sisters and brothers especially Mary Elizabeth who I may be named after. If I have pieced together correctly the rather rambling and disjointed information that has been sent to Dad in old letters I think that Mary Elizabeth born in Ireland on 23rd July 1864 at Mullingar Ireland was married to Harry Wakefield. I found a Harry Penfold Wakefield and Mary Elizabeth Westfield sharing the same page in the marriage index for 4th Qtr of 1883 at St George Hanover Square London. I found Minnie living with her uncle Frank Henry Westfield at Smithfield in the 1881 census - she is listed as Frank's neice and she is 10 in 1881 and born at Chester that is where my Gt grandfather was posted either at Fulwood barracks in Preston Lancs or at the military hospital in Chester where Dad said he worked. By the way another brother of Mary Elizabeth and Minnie was Frank Henry Westfield born at Preston Lancs in 1872. You will see him in the 1881 census with his brother George John as nephews of the college owner George John born in 1820. The Frank Henry born 1851 that Minnie was staying with in 1881 is this Frank Henry's uncle. Mary Sarah was supposed to have had quite a few children. I have also been looking closely at Lionel William born Chester 4Q 1875 and Margaret Florence 1q 1874 at Chester. I found Margaret Florence in the marriage index to William Alfred Andrews. I havn't looked at your suggestion about the name Maker yet. I havn't shuffled enough papers yet to see whether I had her under Wakefield in the 1901 census. Lionel did interest me but the furthest I got was a bmd reference for his birth and then he dropped out of the records on ancestry. The reason Lionel was interesting was because whether he himself is dead or alive I think he may have nephews in Australia who have been named after him and I am going to work on this one. I feel sure I have seen some of Thomas Hipple Westfield's children or grandchildren with the name Lionel but it may be my faulty memory or just co-incidence. Thomas Hipple Westfield was the half brother to Minnie Wilhemina Westfield and George John Miller Westfield and Mary Elizabeth born in Ireland and any other children of Mary Sarah Miller. Just a tip for you Sue if you start looking at the Frank Henry Westfields- they can be extremely confusing there is another Frank Henry Westfield born in the same year as Minnie's brother and he is her uncles son Frank Henry who would be her cousin. So her brother and cousin and Uncle are all Frank Henry Westfield. Her brother and cousin born in the same year also. However her cousin born 1872 is called Frank Henry Louis Westfield so there is a slight difference here. Her brother Frank and of course Mary Elizabeth's brother also had a son who first went to Canada for a year in his twenties and then he came out to live in South Australia Adelaide his name was Harold Frank Westfield and he was born in U.K. and died on 6th June 1996 at Adelaide. His wifes name was Beryl who pre-deceased him by many years. Harold was 93 when he died. His mother was Frank Henry's first wife whose name was Mary Elizabeth Cundic Cundich or Cundell. Harold said she died in Childbirth when he was very young. Frank Henry's next wife was Jessie Nassau and Harold had 3 half siblings, but he was the only child with the first wife. Frank Henry's third wife after the second one died was Hannah Burns and she appears in the Probate registry They lived at 64 Bruce Grove Wickford Essex and he died at Billericay on 24th April 1960. Mary Elizabeth's cousin Frank Henry Louis Westfield died in New Zealand. He was listed in Probate as Frank Henry Louis Westfield of 12 West Smithfield London who died 21st December 1897 in New Zealand. Grant to Maria Jane Westfield, Widow. Anyway Sue I will probably email you soon if I havn't lost your address. I thought I would post this on here in case other researchers may also be interested. Regards Mary Chawner

Mary WESTFIELD of Maryland (1700s)

ewhendon — 2006-01-19 17:44:30Z

Henry HENDON married Mary WESTFIELD 08 Aug 1773 in St. John's Parish, Baltimore Co., MD. Looking for info on possible children from this marriage. ewhendon@sbcglobal.net

WESTFIELD/ WESTPFEL of Germany, England & Canada

tekaybe — 2005-12-09 21:05:46Z

Hi All,

I'm currently compiling 4 years of reseach together, having now FINALLY found a family tree program I like!

I'd like to share this info (and boy is there a lot!- over 1000 people total!!) with anyone I can help, especially "new starters" as I had a hell of a time starting out!

I have info on the following surnames: COVEY LEPPARD MORLEY PENFOLD WESTPFEL WESTFIELD WILKINS WORSFOLD.

I also have photographs of some of these branches, and would LOVE to speak to anyone that might have photos of any of those surnames in the Surrey/Sussex areas! (Norfolk also for MORLEY)

Email me on tekaybe@hotmail.com

Karen

Mary Elizabeth Westfield

SueCoates42 — 2004-10-04 09:18:33Z

Trying to trace Mary Elizabeth Westfield, born 1865 in Mullingar, Eire. Her mother is Mary Sarah (nee Miller) and her father George John Warner Westfield. Her father was serving with the army in Ireland when she was born.
The family were then posted to Preston, Lancs in approx 1875. When her mother died in 1878 she and her sister were sent to a military orphanage ( I believe).
I have found a Mary of the right age and place of birth on the 1901 census. She is now Mary Maker married to John Maker who is from Manchester, Lancs. they have 2 children Ellen 11yrs and Mary 10yrs. Both children were born in New York, USA and I have also found a Mary and a John Maker who arrived at Ellis Island, US in 1893.
Does anyone know if Mary Elizabeth is Mary Maker or know of a Mary Elizabeth Westfield who fits the facts.
Thanks
Sue Coates (nee Westfield)

Re: William Westfield jr and sr

tekaybe1 — 2003-01-27 23:54:48Z

This is the same person again. I have some new information to add to this.

William Westfield or Westpfel, born 1887, married to Mary, had 14 children. Parents: Frederick (b. 1855/1858, d. 1932) and Elija Westpfel (b. 1857)

William Westfield, in the Saskatoon Light Infantry (machine gun division) Canadian Active Service Force. He was based in or lived in Leney, Saskatoon, Saskatchewan, Canada. Parents: Charles Henry/Hewey and Marie (nee Cummings)Westphel/Westfield

German family originally, moved to England, some family went to Canada.

Any help finding info on any of these, or if you think you can help with other things, then please get in touch at tekaybe@hotmail.com

William Westfield jr and sr

tekaybe1 — 2003-01-27 22:50:09Z

William Westfield sr, married to Mary, parents: Frederick and Elisa Westfield

William Westfield jr, in the Saskatoon Light Infantry (machine gun division) Canadian Active Service Force. He was based in or lived in Leney, Saskatoon, Saskatchewan, Canada.

German family originally, moved to England, some family went to Canada. Surname was Anglicised, was probably Westfeld, Westfell, etc

Any help finding info on any of these, or if you think you can help with other things, then please get in touch at tekaybe@hotmail.com

looking for relatives

2001-01-27 09:52:25Z

lokking for 3 sisters and relative of anna mae....was married to frank hanson, nyack,n.y......last known last name mellon

searching family history

2000-05-24 18:08:41Z

I want to know more about my family history. My father name was "Buddy Westfield" he was born in Easley, SC. He was a tall and lean man. 6'2" and never weight more then 170lbs. He had big brown eyes and curley black hair. His complextion was redishbrown. His father name was John Henry Westfield and his mother was Mamie Chance-Westfield. All I know about his parents is that his mother (who lived with his sister Mary in Baltimore) died in Baltimore around 1968/69 and she was around 75 years old. I don't know anything about his father yet. My father served in World WAR II. He lied about his age and went into the service when he was around 16 year old. He got shot in his leg and was later released. He lived in Baltimore where he had a sister "Mary Westfield" before settling in Hartford, CT in the (I think) late 40's. He was married around three times. He died in 1984 at the age of 65. He still has sisters (I don't think he ever talked about having any brothers) and other relatives living in Easley, SC. It is possible that John Henry Westfield my grandfather could have been related to your GrandMother/father and maybe moved to or from Easley d have moved away from Easley.

Trying to locate my grandmother

1999-10-15 18:47:07Z

I'm attempting to locate information about my ancestors, especially my grandmother, Victoria Westfield. I live in Maryland and the only Westfield's I know of are my brothers and sister. My father, Guss Westfield, (deceased 1998) is from South Carolina in the area of Barksdale, Princeton, or WareShoals (near Greenville). If you are related and can possibly shed some light on my search request, I would appreciate it.

My grandmother - Victoria Westfield

1999-09-17 11:11:01Z

I am trying to locate any information about my grandmother. She was born in Princeton, SC in the early 1900's. After she had my father, Guss Westfield, she moved to Chicago, IL and I heard she got married to a man last name was Looper or Luper. I am not sure of the spelling. Then I was told that she moved to Minnesota. Her brother's name was Leo Westfield. I would appreciate any information anyone may have.