Odard de Dutton
Replies: 12
Re: Odard de Dutton
 raywarburton
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Posted: 31 Aug 2008 5:01PM GMT |
Classification: Query
I have now matched the Y-chromosome DNA for the Irish Warburton family I mentioned in an earlier post.
This family appeared in Ireland in the 17th century, as three brothers. The eldest Richard acquired estates around Ireland, mainly at Garryhinch. He was also an MP. His brother George was described as of Aughrim. The youngest was John. They seem to have been a significant Irish Protestant family with links to church and army.
It is said that Richard first appeared as clerk to Cromwell's parliament in Dublin, but he would have been at the tender age of 17, and there is a reference to a merchant called Richard in Dublin in the 1630s. He is probably father to the brothers, and may have been Cromwells clerk.
I have tested a descendant of Richard, and a descendant of George so their common ancestor is about 9 generations back. There were 4 mismatches over 43 markers (2 in the same multicopy marker). I use a mutation rate of .0028, which means that whilst 4 mutations is slightly up on what one might expect, it would still occur in 10% of such situations, so I believe kinship is proved.
The origins of the Irish Warburtons are not documented but they have always claimed kinship with the Warburtons of Arley Hall (via the Warburtons of Hefferston Grange). Various members of the Arley family have accepted this kinship over time (though they were not considered as heirs when the last Warburton of Arley died childless in 1813).
It is therefore possible, but not certain, that the Irish Warburtons carry the same Y-chromosome as the Warburtons of Arley. The link from the Warburtons of Arley to Odard de Dutton seems to be quite well documented though I haven't personally accessed the primary sources.
Now comes the interesting bit. The haplotype of the Irish Warburtons is J2. I have not found this in any other Warburton, or seen it mentioned amongst the various other families believed to be descended from Odard and his brothers.
The distribution of J2 derives from its role as a marker for the post Ice Age Neolithic expansion into Europe. According to Oppenheimer it travelled via the Mediterranean and the Western Atlantic seaboard. It is present in SE England, and across the Channel in France. There is also a hot spot around Pitlochry in Scotland. However it is absent in Ireland, NW England and Scandinavia.
If we assume this haplotype is inherited from Odard (a big assumption but I'll come back to that) then how did he get it? It certainly is difficult to explain in terms of the various family claims of kinship with the Dukes of Normandy. However I think that claim is generally considered a bit dubious. Mush more believable (though still laking contemporary documentary evidence) is the story that Odard and his brothers were sons of the Viscount of Cotentin. It seems likely that to be part of Hugh d'Avranche's retinue, and to receive the favours they did, they would be part of at least the minor nobility in Normandy. It is also conceivable that they might be of original French stock who, maybe as a result of intermarriage, managed to prosper under the Normans. Now Cotentin, or the Cherbourg peninsular is the sort of maritime area that coastally migrating Neolithics might end up in. Conjecture I know, but the most likely explanation of how Odard might have got the J2 haplotype.
All this begs the question as to why it hasn't (yet) appeared anywhere else amongst the modern carriers of Warburton, Dutton or any other of the names deriving from the brothers. A number of reasons might be considered:
1. Were the 5 brothers real brothers, of just brothers-in-arms. This might explain differences between some families, but Warburton and Dutton are both descended from Odard himself.
2. Many modern families are probably descended from other adopters of the name, or from illegitimate sons. Many lines from Odard are also known to have died out.
3. A recent television drama centred on a (fictitious) aristocrat who had three wives and 2 sons, but was then found to be impotent. As the first wife explained "All aristocratic families 'breed out' from time to time - its all that keeps them sane". Was J2 introduced by such 'breeding out'?
Pending a future match I guess we are left with conjecture. I will now look for other Warburton families where the earliest ancestors are described as gentlemen.
This family appeared in Ireland in the 17th century, as three brothers. The eldest Richard acquired estates around Ireland, mainly at Garryhinch. He was also an MP. His brother George was described as of Aughrim. The youngest was John. They seem to have been a significant Irish Protestant family with links to church and army.
It is said that Richard first appeared as clerk to Cromwell's parliament in Dublin, but he would have been at the tender age of 17, and there is a reference to a merchant called Richard in Dublin in the 1630s. He is probably father to the brothers, and may have been Cromwells clerk.
I have tested a descendant of Richard, and a descendant of George so their common ancestor is about 9 generations back. There were 4 mismatches over 43 markers (2 in the same multicopy marker). I use a mutation rate of .0028, which means that whilst 4 mutations is slightly up on what one might expect, it would still occur in 10% of such situations, so I believe kinship is proved.
The origins of the Irish Warburtons are not documented but they have always claimed kinship with the Warburtons of Arley Hall (via the Warburtons of Hefferston Grange). Various members of the Arley family have accepted this kinship over time (though they were not considered as heirs when the last Warburton of Arley died childless in 1813).
It is therefore possible, but not certain, that the Irish Warburtons carry the same Y-chromosome as the Warburtons of Arley. The link from the Warburtons of Arley to Odard de Dutton seems to be quite well documented though I haven't personally accessed the primary sources.
Now comes the interesting bit. The haplotype of the Irish Warburtons is J2. I have not found this in any other Warburton, or seen it mentioned amongst the various other families believed to be descended from Odard and his brothers.
The distribution of J2 derives from its role as a marker for the post Ice Age Neolithic expansion into Europe. According to Oppenheimer it travelled via the Mediterranean and the Western Atlantic seaboard. It is present in SE England, and across the Channel in France. There is also a hot spot around Pitlochry in Scotland. However it is absent in Ireland, NW England and Scandinavia.
If we assume this haplotype is inherited from Odard (a big assumption but I'll come back to that) then how did he get it? It certainly is difficult to explain in terms of the various family claims of kinship with the Dukes of Normandy. However I think that claim is generally considered a bit dubious. Mush more believable (though still laking contemporary documentary evidence) is the story that Odard and his brothers were sons of the Viscount of Cotentin. It seems likely that to be part of Hugh d'Avranche's retinue, and to receive the favours they did, they would be part of at least the minor nobility in Normandy. It is also conceivable that they might be of original French stock who, maybe as a result of intermarriage, managed to prosper under the Normans. Now Cotentin, or the Cherbourg peninsular is the sort of maritime area that coastally migrating Neolithics might end up in. Conjecture I know, but the most likely explanation of how Odard might have got the J2 haplotype.
All this begs the question as to why it hasn't (yet) appeared anywhere else amongst the modern carriers of Warburton, Dutton or any other of the names deriving from the brothers. A number of reasons might be considered:
1. Were the 5 brothers real brothers, of just brothers-in-arms. This might explain differences between some families, but Warburton and Dutton are both descended from Odard himself.
2. Many modern families are probably descended from other adopters of the name, or from illegitimate sons. Many lines from Odard are also known to have died out.
3. A recent television drama centred on a (fictitious) aristocrat who had three wives and 2 sons, but was then found to be impotent. As the first wife explained "All aristocratic families 'breed out' from time to time - its all that keeps them sane". Was J2 introduced by such 'breeding out'?
Pending a future match I guess we are left with conjecture. I will now look for other Warburton families where the earliest ancestors are described as gentlemen.